Mike Pence was reportedly “beside himself.” Paul Ryan disinvited the nominee from his big shindig in Wisconsin today. Rep. Chaffetz and other prominent Republicans publicly withdrew their support. Though a bit more profane than usual, the video is entirely consistent with everything we’ve known about Donald Trump all along. Why are Republicans suddenly outraged by this?
Before we wind up the GOPLifer blog in a few days (fingers crossed), here are a few last thoughts on this incident and its implications:
Republicans didn’t care how vile Trump is when they thought he might win.
There’s a sick, disturbing power-worship in the way Republicans have handled Donald Trump, going all the way back to his campaign announcement. The way they cower when it looks like he’s winning and pounce when he looks weak is revolting behavior in a bunch of adults. Mike Pence wasn’t “beside himself” because he had learned something new about the man he agreed to support. He was upset because it was finally clear that Trump was collapsing, and that the rubble would come tumbling down on him. These people following Trump, many of whom I had respected until very recently, are disgusting.
Our election cycle isn’t nearly as long as we think.
Media coverage and the fevered hype from those of us who pay attention makes it seem like Americans spend half of each Presidential term electing the next one. That really isn’t the case. Only about one in three of the Americans who will vote for President bothers to tune in to the primary process. Our election cycle actually runs from just after Labor Day to November. A minority of the country is paying attention before October. If it seems like the whole character of the process changed after Labor Day, that’s because the rest of the country suddenly joined the party. Keep that in mind in 2020.
Don’t act surprised.
Did you hear Donald Trump’s speech announcing his candidacy? Did you read his comments about POW’s? Did you see the way he treated Megyn Kelly after the first Republican debate? Did you see his comments about the Khan family? Have you had the slightest awareness of his multiple messy divorces and sordid private life? What does it take to make Republicans feel something for another human being? No one has the slightest basis on which to act surprised. We have all been on notice since day one that this man is a horrid, destructive cretin. For some reason, millions of Republicans were willing to set that aside and make him our President. For Republicans who are shocked this morning, ask yourself why. Why were you willing tolerate this?
The Trump scandal no one cares about.
As a private citizen, Trump played a significant role in the campaign to railroad the Central Park 5, including a concerted effort at the time to reinstate the death penalty. Years after we discovered to our shame that those teenagers had been wrongly convicted, Trump this week defended his role in the case and insisted that they are guilty. My fellow Republicans, THAT’s the man you were proposing to place in command of the Justice Department. Again, no one in the GOP cares when Donald Trump says (or threatens to do) horrifying things to racial and religious minorities. This is a problem, folks.
Maybe “political correctness” isn’t such a bad thing.
Maybe, just maybe, it isn’t OK for people to go around spouting bigoted, ignorant slurs about other human beings they don’t understand. Perhaps the world might be a better place if we gave the slightest thought to how the words we choose affect other people. Here’s a thought for my friends still in the party: if Republicans weren’t so cavalier about so-called “political correctness” you might be winning this election.
Time for a “Pro-Life” headcheck
I’ve argued for a long time that America doesn’t have a politically relevant pro-life voting bloc. Scratch the surface of the so-called pro-life movement and waves of misogynistic spiders come pouring out. It is impossible to conceive of a political movement genuinely interested in the dignity of life that would line up behind a man who pours out invective against refugees, religious minorities and women. Yet, even this weekend, those sick, confused bastards keep defending him.
This would be a better country if we recognized that Tim Kaine is a far better intellectual ambassador for the pro-life movement than Mike Pence. As Republicans pick through the rubble of this election cycle, hopefully someone will explore whether a minimally self-aware pro-life movement might offer some hope for the future.
Republicans face a frightening empathy gap
The greatest challenge for Republicans in coming years, if the party is going to remain intact, is empathy. While the rest of America works its way forward toward a culture capable of respecting and protecting people beyond the bounds of clan, tribe and race, Republicans remain trapped inside a tribal fortress. Republicans seem like nice people, people like Mike Pence and Paul Ryan, who are nonetheless bafflingly incapable of grasping the humanity of people beyond their kinship groups. Black people are real human beings who feel things. Muslims are just like you. Mexicans want good things for their children. These simple statements seem to stick in the throats of Republican leaders. Why? Seriously, why is that so hard?
The challenge facing the Clinton Administration.
Hillary Clinton is about to assume leadership over a nation of people who didn’t particularly want her in charge. Many of us who will be voting for her feel confident about her competence and intelligence, but there is nothing in her policy agenda that attracted us. She hasn’t threatened to do anything stupid, criminal, cruel, or insane, which makes her an empirically superior choice over any of her rivals for the White House. That’s her campaign in a nutshell.
That isn’t her fault. She seems like she was prepared to run and win a campaign based on policy and vision and ideas. But this is how events played out.
I am not exactly your average low-information voter. I have degrees in Political Science and Law and have been an active political volunteer for almost three decades, but I don’t even know what her tax plan looks like. When your house is on fire, do you ask what kind of water the firemen plan to use? I’m confident I’ll pay more taxes under Clinton than Trump. Frankly that seems fair. I’ll happily write a check to hold off Fascism (or its cousin, Idiocracy) for a few more years while we all work out some alternative plans.
Politically, this means that a very large chunk of the support Clinton leveraged to reach the White House will have evaporated by Inauguration Day. She will launch her Administration under the shadow of Churchill Syndrome – “thanks for rescuing Western Civilization, now when do you plan to leave?”
She is a remarkably capable political operator. She will need every ounce of those skills to build a governing coalition from the alignments she rode to victory.
That is all. Enjoy your weekend. If things come together we should have a new site ready by early next week.
Chris Ladd is a Texan living in the Chicago area. He has been involved in grassroots Republican politics for most of his life. He was a Republican precinct committeeman in suburban Chicago until he resigned from the party and his position after the 2016 Republican Convention. He can be reached at gopliferchicago at gmail dot com.
GOPLifer 
“Why the outrage now?”
Well, here is one person theory (courtesy of CNN).
Symone D. Sanders, a CNN Political commentator and former national press secretary for Bernie Sanders commented on the issue on twitter.
“You apparently can say whatever you want about Mexicans, Hispanics & Black people, but the Republican Party draws the line on white women.”
http://money.cnn.com/2016/10/09/news/economy/trump-white-women-race/index.html
Interesting point.
A story from the history of 20th century Indiana, USA (Mike Pence’s state) and the members of the Republican Party that appears similar to today’s situation.
The second iteration of the Klu Klux Klan and it’s leader at the time who turned this infamous group or racial terrorists in the public consciousness into modern day heroes.
They became a group of American “patriots” fighting not just civil rights for blacks, but foreign political viruses like socialists and anarchists, swarthy immigrants and Jews. Their ranks swelled and their secret influence over Republican politicians and judges swelled through financial patronage (aka bribes).
The primary conceit was that the Klan could protect and preserve the purity of white women.
This revamped image and mission blew apart ironically when its leader, David Curtiss “Steve” Stephenson abducted, drugged, raped and murdered a young white women. Her death apparently was the partial result from significant bite wounds on her body and breast that turned into a staph infection.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/D._C._Stephenson
So much for protecting white “Protestant womenhood”.
And here we are yet again in 2016…
Mike Pence is being forced to back away from Trump over the possibility he committed sexual assault(s) or had the mentality of a sexually aggressive predator. It is eerie how similar Pence’s dilemma mirrors his Indiana Republican predecessors who had to eventually back away from D.C. Stephenson and the Klan.
The party back them paid a heavy price for the revelations of their prior association.
So people please remember… history has this nasty habit of repeating itself with distressing regularity.
Here’s what I thought. Trump offered no substance. He was physically intimidating. He threatened Clinton with prosecution and jail! He played to his base on the ACA, Benghazi, and emails. He offered nothing else of substance.
Yeah. He’s a one trick pony. His comments about jailing her in sure thrilled his base, they do nothing to bring in new voters though.
The CNN/ORC instapoll, which tends to be fairly accurate relative to the polls that come out a few days later, say Clinton is the winner, 54%-37%, for what it’s worth
Highlighted in the WSJ today….Trump’s “apology” and his plan to “jail her”. The Journal is so transparent in their political views….which is their right but it’s sad because this used to be a fine newspaper.
Yeah, let’s all just step back for a moment and let that breathe for a moment, okay?
………………..
Okay, we are talking about a presidential nominee ordering his AG (not only an obscene and flagrant disregard for the law, but just plain illegal) to prosecute a political opponent not because of any actual wrongdoing, but for a perceived slight and his own wounded ego.
Really, it comes as no surprise the nauseating degree of hypocrisy from Republicans that they would accuse President Obama of executive overreach at really every available turn and yet this is what they offer to the American people.
Just f*** them all. I hope every last one of them crashes and burns in November. Miserable, disgusting wretches, the lot of them.
Tomorrow there is some big GOP conference call regarding Trump. Per Ben Ginsberg tonight, he thinks Trump staunched the bleeding and that the RNC will stick with him because the alternative is worse….meaning, Trump’s base would major revolt and cause more problems down ballot. (The Senate, the Senate) When pressed about whether there is any possibility of T winning, Ginsberg said it “could” happen….if a bomb was dropped about Clinton…T’s base is so fired up that anything is possible even as he thinks the odds of T winning are very small. With 30 days to go, and both teams digging for dirt, who knows?
WaPo fact-checking of debate.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fact-checker/wp/2016/10/10/fact-checking-the-second-clinton-trump-presidential-debate/?wpisrc=nl_fact&wpmm=1
Whoa
wow
At least one commentator after the debate said he thought tRump staunched the bleeding…
I think Trump did a much better job than debate #1 but most of the pundits I heard felt he staunched the bleeding but didn’t expand his base.
He didn’t make it worse, but that’s not what he needed. He needed a huge win, a blow out. He didn’t even get a win at all, if you judge these things by grasp of policy and ideas.
It was the equivalent of a baseball team down 10-0 and they bring in a reliever who throws a 1-2-3 inning. Yeah, you didn’t make it worse, but youre still losing big time.
You know what’s sad? He didn’t win on points but because he didn’t perform poorly, he appeared to win! Low, low bar……..
Corrected. He congratulated Trump on great debate and said he was looking forward to campaigning with him.
Anyone watching the post-debate panel on msnbc? Chris Matthews was speaking to Conway and asked if she was with the campaign until the bitter end. She answered, “I’m with him until the bitter end, unless…” then realized what she said and let it go.
Hmmmm…
http://www.msnbc.com/hardball/watch/conway-i-ll-stick-with-trump-unless-782474819904
They came back to her on that point and she clarified, saying she was with him to the end.
A few minutes in, it appears tRump will run the debate again.
This was the debate I assumed would happen once both had finished the primaries. It was sickening, disheartening, and demotivating. In the end it probably doesn’t help Trump, but depending on people’s perspectives he may have pulled Clinton down to his level (I myself think she tried her best but the mere fact that they argued so loudly goes against her favor).
I wouldn’t be surprised if the Carl Becker moment is the moment most people really actually remember. A weary normal dude asking, “Is there anything you two can appreciate for each other?” Unfortunately, Clinton then praised Trump’s children and then promoted herself, whereas Trump actually praised Clinton ‘as a fighter’ and his only self-praise was that he ‘says it like it is’. I believe that taken in a vacuum that works better for Trump, showing that he answered the question directly AND selling the ‘tell it like it is’ narrative, whereas Clinton will seem more self-involved and jumping around the question.
But that’s in a vacuum, which this election is not. What other people saw is probably as different as any sort of Rorscach test.
Me, I think the Republican party owes us all an apology.
No content from the bully boy. Little opportunity to find out if Hillary is really the policy nerd she is reputed to be, although she did mention a specific war lord by name, causing the great unread amongst us to exhale, “What?”
I’ll be interested to see a breakdown in how much time each candidate held the floor.
Lawrence O’Donnell just confirmed time for each candidate and Trump exceeded Clinton by one minute 5 seconds but we’ll probably hear claims from Trump team to the contrary. That is the official time.
Formed, I’m not sure I watched the same debate as you. When did she get down to his level? She seemed to keep her dignity and stay above the fray. How.many dozen times did he interrupt her? She didn’t interupt him once. He was hurling out juvenile insult, such as “devil”.
He acted like a petulant child and picked fights with everyone including the moderators.
I thought he looked terrible, and she gave an unexciting, but competent and knowledge performance.
BTW, what’s with the sniffing? What an annoying problem for a public speaker.
I don’t know about looks, but what I saw is that she came in ready to attack and he started the brawl early on, bringing it out faster than she could handle. As a result, she engaged instead of doing the redirect and disengage she did in the last debate. It turned things ugly instead of refocusing those things, and as a result it sold the idea that ‘both sides’ are as ‘ugly’ as each other rather than the idea that she ‘goes high when they go low.’
The rest of the debate was fairly typical minus the bitter aftertaste of the first thirty minutes. In any normal situation I’d give it to Clinton. But the problem here is that Trump can only stand even or go down — Clinton, however, can fall hard. I think he brought her down, no matter whether he succeeded at staying even or falling. Bringing her down has her with a lot more to lose, due to the volatility around her campaign.
Then in that ending she made it about her and he actually praised her WHILE selling the narrative that he’s a straight talker right after her peripatetic answer.
I stand by what I said after last debate: people remember movies but the movie most wins their impressions on the first and last moments. If this were a movie, we saw two ugly people being assholes to each other, and then one of them take the high road. The one that did wasn’t Clinton.
Nobody’s going to remember the ‘issues’, they’re going to remember the common baseline talking points of both parties and the fact that the debate was ugly. This hurts Clinton, in my opinion.
I guess we’ll see. I’m no expert on how people perceive this stuff.
In thinking more about Formdib’s comments and your own about Clinton’s performance – I have mixed feelings. I cannot imagine how difficult it must be to debate Trump, esp. when you are a policy wonk like Clinton. He is a bully and it is hard to stay on point when you have a large man pacing behind you and making so many charges that are outrageous, where do you begin? This is probably part of his strategy to keep her off balance, which I think worked although she was dignified throughout. His statement that he would have his A.G. charge her and jail her was outrageous in an American debate. The fact checkers say that the Trump lies were far greater in this debate than any other….maybe 4-5 times as many.
I wish she could have rebutted several of his comments but the 2 minute time frame with him butting in so much really made that difficult, which was probably his plan.
I just don’t see it. What, specifically, did she do that came off as inappropriate attacks? I thought she did amazing well staying high when he went low, especially considering how low the went.
He threatwned to jail his political opponent should he win like a 2 bit dictator. That’s shockingly unprecedented.
I didn’t see ANYthing remotely similar from her. He called her “the devil”. He acted like a petulant child and whined because the moderators were “ganging up” on him. He said “3 against 1 eh? Ok….ok”
I thought she did an excellent job of ignoring his insults and talking knowledgeably about policies. Obviously, I’m biased, but I really didn’t see the debate remotely the same way you did.
I give T points for his compliment to her but he did go second (-; And, it’s easier to compliment C than T (-;
I am actually sort of wishing I followed up on an invitation to a public screening so I could feel out how other people felt about it, but then again I live in a deep blue city.
I guess what I have to say is this: this was a debate apparently about and for ‘undecided’ and ‘independent’ voters. Instead, two politicians talked argued for thirty minutes over nothing the undecided or independent voters asked.
Trump did have his usual assortment of baked in negatives, but he did a good job at slamming Clinton with her usual assortment of baked in negatives.
Then after several questions that basically reflected the usual party talking points (i.e. it sounds like nothing the undecided voter hasn’t heard before, because they’re not here for party line accounting), they’re finally presented with a moment to meet common ground, and he takes a step toward and her a step away.
I’m a technocratic policy wonk oriented person. I prefer Clinton’s ideas to Trump’s, most especially since she has some and he doesn’t, but there are a few I actually genuinely support even if he had alternatives.
I got NONE of those policy points from the debate. What I got was a very bitter, ugly ongoing argument about character that made me feel sick. If I were an undecided voter, my decision would probably be to vote for neither of them. This hurts Clinton. It doesn’t necessarily hurt Trump, since without policy ideas he didn’t really have anything to gain anyway.
I’m not saying Trump won. I’m saying we all lost.
What I do give you and I hope the takeaway of this debate is is the lack of precedence in a debate of a major party leader threatening to jail his opponent…
… and the fact that the audience clapped and laughed to it.
That, if I were a media pundit, is where I’d focus my attentions. Not how Clinton staged cameras to keep our eyes on his face.
That said RobA, I hope people see the debate more the way you did and the way I wanted to. I’m just feeling pessimistic this season because if more people saw things the way you and I did, Trump wouldn’t be at 18% chance of winning the election by 538’s measure — he wouldn’t even be on the ballot.
was watching the pre-debate talking heads and then this happened…Trump invites reporters to his debate prep and encounter women accusing Bill Clinton of rape or sexual assault…too depressing.
http://www.politico.com/story/2016/10/donald-trump-bill-clinton-accusers-229441
Yes, watching MSNBC now and they showed a clip from the year when Paula Jones came forward and he spoke up for Bill saying Jones was a liar…..
Old video doesn’t go away, it just sits on a shelf until it’s needed again…….
Just read that Billy Bush is going to have to take a hiatus….Seems his network was unhappy with his participatory role in the Trumpmobile sex chat….CNN reports he will not appear monday morning on the Today Show….
Fall-out can be a bitch…….oops – nah, it’s a perfect segue.
Frank Bruni, NYT, has an article today that lays out some of the problems Hillary will face if elected. To begin, the ultra conservative members of the Freedom Caucus already are planning their assault:
” Already, some House conservatives have called for hearings about Clinton’s emails after any Clinton inauguration; one of them has already raised the specter of impeachment. At this stage, it’s in the very DNA of the relationship between Clintons and Republicans for there to be dire threats, special investigations, public grilling. It’s a reflex, a tic. Not even a landslide on Nov. 8 would change that.”
Then there is the vindictive, attention-seeking Trump:
“…no president in my lifetime has confronted what Clinton surely will: an opponent who is vanquished but not remotely humbled….at no point in this campaign — or in his life, for that matter — has he demonstrated an interest in the public good that approaches his interest in his own celebrity.
Mitt Romney, John McCain, John Kerry, Al Gore: All of them lowered their voices and ceded the stage to the men who got the trophy they sought. Trump has made clear that he won’t extend the same courtesy to the woman poised to beat him.”
It’s a very good read and it clearly shows that even with winning, Hillary will have the fight of her life on her hands. As for Trump, the only way to neutralize him is if he finally gets charged significantly for some of his past misdeeds and decides the spotlight requires more honesty than he will ever be capable or willing to offer.
The Freedom Caucus – note how quiet they have been. Do not mistake that for inattention.
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/10/09/opinion/sunday/hillary-clintons-poisoned-prize.html?ribbon-ad-idx=3&rref=opinion&module=Ribbon&version=context®ion=Header&action=click&contentCollection=Opinion&pgtype=article
That was always going to happen no matter who the democratic nominee was.
“That was always going to happen no matter who the Democratic nominee was”
Maybe, but there is a level of animosity for Hillary Clinton among conservatives that seems unparalleled in politics. Best to understand what’s ahead. If Obama had, he might have made better use of his first two years in office. Hillary won’t be as naive, but unless she wins by an overwhelming landslide, and maybe not even then, she is going to have a tough 4 years. She’s enough of a realist to understand the odds, but living it is always more difficult than anticipating it.
If that’s going to happen then so be it. With senate ours being likely for the next two years, enough progress, at least in the sense of nominating Supreme Court justices that will alter its direction for a decade or so, I’m ok with Hillary getting more than a few brickbats in her (hopefully) first term in office.
Don’t count your Senate chicks just yet, Pedneuro. We all hope that Dems take it, but it is going to be close. The other point about the Senate is that if we take it with a bare majority, we will still be vulnerable to filibuster by the Republicans. This will be especially critical with SCOTUS appointments.
Ps: sorry for the disjointed language. :p
I wouldn’t counter your post by saying anything but that I am counting on you to send me that scarf you promised if Dems get the senate. Which we will.
Secondly, There is virtually no possibility of a filibuster proof majority, that was never gonna happen. What WILL happen is once dems get the senate the filibuster for judicial nominations will be gone.
Charmin’ Charlie is gonna be my new best friend to make good on my scarf offer (-; I’ll love to lose that bet!
As for filibuster/cloture – all we’d need to pick up (ALL she said with great blustering confidence) are 10 seats….
First polls are trickling in, and it appears to be worst case scenario for the GoP. That is, enough independent and moderates are horrified to hurt those who don’t distance from Trump, and yet it has made almost no dent in support among Trump supporters, who will blame the GOPe for their feckless capitulation to the PC police.
Basically, the down ballot gets hit on all sides: those that don’t unendorse Trump will be punished by moderates and independents, those that do will be punished by his base.
This is only one poll, that encapsulates just the last day of the scandal, the picture will become more clear in the coming days. But it’s got to be mighty uncomfortable to be in the GOp right now.
http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2016/10/09/trump_post_tape_polls_aren_t_as_devastating_as_they_could_be.html
The article you cited headlines the same data in a different manner than you have done here.
Yeah, they’re both basic the same conclusion, except I looked at it from the GOP, not Trump.
As the headline says, the polls suggest this isn’t as bad as most ppl thought…..for Trump. But that very dynamic makes it worst case scenario for the GOP.
Beat case scenario for the GOP would be EVERYONE is turned off by Trump, so they can show off to the moderates and independents how “disgusted and appalled” they are by unambiguously dumping Trump.
The fact that GOP voters could care less is better then expected situation for Trump, but it’s a nightmare for the GOp.
Wow some grim faces in the trump gallery.
Drip, drip, drip……
Trump is being subjected to the political equivalent of Chinese water torture.
http://www.rawstory.com/2016/10/trump-boasted-of-owning-miss-usa-pageant-so-he-could-watch-naked-contestants-backstage-report
Drip drip drip goes the water…
http://www.politico.com/story/2016/10/rnc-halts-all-victory-project-work-for-trump-229363
“In an email from the RNC to a victory program mail vendor, with the subject line “Hold on all projects,” the committee asked the vendor to “put a hold” on mail production.
“Please put a hold/stop on all mail projects right now. If something is in production or print it needs to stop. Will update you when to proceed,” Lauren Toomey, a staffer in the RNC’s political department, wrote in an email that was obtained by POLITICO.”
Suddenly Kellyanne Conway and Reince Priebus had “scheduling problems” and were unable to appear on the Sunday talk shows. They were replaced by Rudy Giuliani. He’s the best they can do? Geez.
Maybe Kellyanne is still soaking in the tub over at SNL (-;
Donna Brazielle is taking full advantage.
Brazille is very capable. I met her back in the 80s in LA. She was just starting her career in politics and it was obvious she was a smart, thoughtful operative and would do well. I’m certain she will fill up the interview time to great advantage.
Giuliani – what a loser……Really? Really?
http://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/presidential-races/300072-giuliani-trump-was-shocked-to-hear-he-had-said-such
Speaking of “This Week”, whoever the lady shilling for Trump on the round table segment is (short Bkack/grey hair), she is effing clueless about sexual harassment. Her response to Rep. Ellis was along the lines of they didn’t quit, so how bad could it have really been? Some of these conservatives are so out of touch.
I decided to wander on over to FOXnews.com to see what the conversation was like there. Here’s their most recent polling result:
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/elections/2016/polls
And, this: http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2016/10/08/mr-trump-its-time-for-some-debate-judo-heres-how-to-bring-it-to-st-louis.html
Agreed Fly. Part of it is they truly don’t understand these things.
Look at Paul Ryan. Even though his statement re: Trump was well meaning enough, it shows he truly doesn’t get the while equality thing.
I don’t think women want or need to be “championed and revered”. There is a distinct patronizing tone to that, a sort of benevolent sexism. What I think they want/need instead of being “revered” is being “respected” the same way one would respect anyone else, and to be given the same opportunities to succeed given to everyone else. Save the “championing” and “revering” for your wife, maybe. Women can take care of themselves, we just need to make sure that there are no built in disadvantages in the system and let them champion themselves.
It would be an interesting post if Chris would explain the historical shift by the GOP regarding their views of women. I can’t accept that they don’t understand…we’ve come too far for that simple an excuse. It must deal more with the conservative belief that men are superior to women and go downhill from there. Why not an egalitarian pov – which essentially respects the strengths of each gender who work together towards a common goal? No one loses in relationships built upon respect and shared responsibility, but if one member has to dominate, that is where things break down – which applies to all relationships, as a matter of fact. When this domineering mindset transfers into policy and law (as well as behavior), it can be very damaging not only to the individuals who are directly affected, but to the broader principle of equality.
If you read through the Fox link on “debate judo” I posted above, I think you’ll have a pretty good idea of what will be thrown at Clinton tonight. In fact, I’m going to print it out and score it…
The debate judo is little more than what’s been thrown at Hillary for years. As many commentators have said, this is already “baked in the cake.” I expect Hillary will be prepared to deal with all this effectively.
Better yet, 1mime, here are some debate bingo cards you can use to play with family and friends!
http://tvline.com/2016/10/09/presidential-debate-bingo-cards-clinton-trump-2/
I’ll bet Trump’s little fingers never stray to a glass of water – he’ll be hydrated – and he’ll be given an antihistamine for his sniffing, leaving the audience with the new, improved Trump model…the one that sneers and makes ugly comments. That’s enough to contend with, no?
Some of the chatter from the stigginit crowd:
“THE PLAN FOR PAYBACK TO TRAITORS: On 11/8 Trump supporters WILL ONLY VOTE for @realDonaldTrump and SKIP all other GOP on ballot.”
I 100% agree. Please proceed.
If that happens there will be a bloodbath on Senate and House races. A bloodbath. A dream come true.
It’s exactly why people like Ryan and McConnell were doing their “I think what the nominee said was wrong, but I’m still endorsing him for President” balancing act. I’m amazed so many held on this long. Now they’re in between the rock and the hard place- in pandering to the college educated White vote, they enrage the Trump fans. They need both groups to win and now they can’t appeal to both.
From what I observe, the college educated white crowd is lost. They might as well double down on the stigginit crowd.
Another observation from the grass roots level; I live in TX-22, which is solidly gerrymandered to the GOP side. The political signs are starting to go up, but far fewer than in past elections. Most of them are for Olson (Congressman) and GOP state lege candidates. Only a handful of Trump signs in my neck of the woods so far.
I live in the Meyerland area and on my street it’s solid Hillary signs. I did notice one Johnson sign.
I live in Spring Branch. On my three-mile wogging route through three neighborhoods, there is only one yard with a political sign: Hillary.
I am going to have to find a Clinton field office to pick up a sign….We live in Montgomery County and you have to really hunt to find sources…I always put out a yard sign just to pique my neighbors…they already think I’ve got a screw loose (ever since my 2 Obama signs) so why not (-;
I don’t understand yard signs and bumper stickers. Of what value is it to signal to random strangers, potentially angry and judgmental ones, your alignment on something they could take out on you?
I’ve had friends run off the road due to their bumper stickers, as well as confronted in parking lots and so forth. Yard signs seem to often become targets for vandals, and that vandalism can extend to more property than just the mere sign.
Which would normally mean I’d defiantly defend their usage for the purposes of free speech, except that your front lawn and the back of your car in an inherently depersonalized situation such as traffic is really not any useful or positive venue to communicate, especially in six words or less.
It’s already hard enough talking politics to people you trust, in person, in a calm and reasonable space. Why flash that shit out there for strangers?
Exposure and influence, formdib. If bumper stickers and yard signs didn’t work, they ‘d be long gone. This is especially true for yard signs where you have a relationship with neighbors. Obviously there will be those who disagree – they are welcome to put out their own signs. The reason I do so (speaking only for myself) is the hope of influencing those who may need passive information, and standing up for my candidate. I really don’t care if I am the only Democrat on my street or in my neighborhood – it is important to me to speak out.
As for bumper signs, if someone attempts to run you off the road for a bumper sign, that could be dangerous, but I haven’t seen that happen – tho it probably depends upon where one lives.
In a large metropolitan area, I would think different rules apply but in a residential area, yard signs and bumper stickers are more acceptable and effective. I have had neighbors stop me at the mail kiosk and ask me questions and/or tell me they are voting for xyz. It is rare in my many years of putting out signs that I have ever had it be a negative.
That said, I really don’t give a flip if my candidate’s sign in my yard bothers them. The beautiful thing about FOS is each of us has that right. Do what you are most comfortable doing is always the best choice.
I only post signs/ bumper stickers if I am enthusiastically FOR you, because then it is worth the possible trouble caused by jerks. Chris’ explanation of why he’s voting for Clinton this time is a good explanation for my decision to also do so, although I’m not holding my nose quite as tightly. So no yard signs for me this year. But if she does a good job, I’ll consider signs for 2020.
Respectfully, this may be the most important year ever to consider putting out a yard sign or bumper sticker.
On the other hand, I had occasion to travel to an amigo’s favorite fishing bay on the other side of the airport in Rockport last week, and the profusion of Trump campaign signs was truly amazing to behold. I am really glad that we have the major metropolitan areas to counter those GOP strongholds. We will beat Trump without signage for sure!
I grew up counseled against bumper stickers by my mom. She was used to being the lonely Democrat in a very Republican area.
My neighborhood usually has yard signs all over though. Four years ago there were Romney signs all over. This year? One Trump sign. Just one. All the rest of the yard signs are for US Representatives, state offices, or city council races. There are a LOT of city council race signs. My area has fantastic voter turnout, usually, and there’ve been two successful recall elections since I have lived here. People here vote their minds.
But, the neighborhood seems horribly conflicted over the presidential election.
I once helped organize a write-in campaign for school committee on one week’s notice (it had been quite a school committee meeting). The quickly proliferating yard signs throughout my small town sent a powerful message — and we won.
Small towns, neighborhoods where people know one another, is where yard signs mean the most. In more commercial displays, it doesn’t have the personal resonance you and your neighbor offer.
OK, Pres. Obama (-;
I cannot see any way out of this, maybe even the House will be in play.
Anything other then a full throated endorsement of Trump will be seen as weak and feckless by the deplorables and they will be punished. Remember, these ppl care not a lick about “conservative values”. They don’t care about lower taxes for the rich. They aren’t particularly religious, so don’t care too much about the SCOTUS. All they care about is Trump and his promise to make America white again. If they feel Trump is being treated unfairly, they will no doubt scorch the earth on the way out.
Given what I can glean of this type of voter, I think there will be more then a few ballots that votes Trump at the top, followed by Dems all down the ticket. One huge middle finger to the despicable Establishment on the way out.
And of course, if they DONT whole heartedly unendorse Trump, they’re cooked with independent and moderate Republican women.
I don’t think there exists thread thin enough to thread this needle.
Well done, Rob! Our millennial posters add so much to this blog – all of you! Actually, I kind of think all of our little gang are pretty special….hey, it’s Sunday (-;
1mime, yes you guys (and girls) are all pretty awesome!
Happy Canadian Thanksgiving to you Mime (and everyone) 🙂
Perhaps some day our neighbors to the south will finally understand someday: Thanksgiving belongs in October! 😉
Enjoy your Thanksgiving, Rob, but hope you can watch the town hall (or at least DVR it)…Canada has reclaimed you but America needs you too!
Here’s a little primer on what “could” happen at the town hall tonight. Written by a reporter who has accompanied Clinton all over the world, she has first-hand knowledge of her skills and weaknesses in this format. All of us would be well advised not to count Trump out. If ever there was a time when he will have to perform, tonight is it. I’m sure Clinton will have a tough night but will handle it.
http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/10/hillary-clinton-town-hall-debate-2016-214329
I hope she sticks to policy. Trump is imploding all by himself and doesn’t need any input from her. This is her chance to sell people on her ideas.
I don’t think it will be that easy, Fly, but I agree she should try to explain her policy positions.
I don’t want to give my hopes up and predicting anything this election cycle is bound to set you for disappointment, but if the remaining < 30 days of this election season was just Republicans yelling at each other increasingly shrilly, I'd be satisfied with how this whole fiasco turned out.
I'd absolutely love for statistical data in pure votes showing Trump only, no down ballot votes, and down ballot only, no Trump votes significant enough to send the message that these are two different voting blocks at this point and there's no reasonably expectation on making the ends meet. Not that the GOP is very good at the, "So here's this data… what shall we learn from it?" way of doing things.
I've also changed my mind on the whole "Tonight's debate gonna be good!" and think it's probably going to quite upsetting in places. I'm going to watch them anyway, because at this point it's binary: it will either land the final nail in the coffin (60% likely), which will be historic to see, or will actually create a surprise turnaround, which would be historic to see (5% likely; remaining 35% I'm giving over to the fact that predictions and probabilities this year aren't worth shit).
I've been thinking about my Trump loving friend a lot, wondering what's going through his brain right now. Perhaps I don't want to know. But I'm super abjectly curious.
“I’m giving over to the fact that predictions and probabilities this year aren’t worth shit.”
We shall know soon, Formdib. Personally, I think Trump is in survival mode and will do better than most people expect, given where things are at present. It is interesting to ponder whether just not destroying himself on stage will be considered a win (for him) or whether the bar will FINALLY be raised for his performance. Because – that is all it will be. The man has no moral core and he is finally being seen for who he is and isn’t by people who aren’t as rabid as he is.
I have a feeling that Trump will say something about not supporting people who do not support him. Classic Trump!
It would not take too many Trump Republican supporters to not vote down ballot to turn the tide in some of these elections!
A dream come true:-))!
There’s so much oxygen in your posts… thanks for helping me breathe throughout this one!
Why the outrage only now? Because this party is sicker and more crippled than anyone thought possible. Every time we think they’ve hit rock bottom, Republicans remind us that they can still dig a little bit deeper and they don’t disappoint.
This recent article from Jamelle Bouie from Slate gives quite the frank and honest explanation as to the “why” here: http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/politics/2016/10/the_horror_is_everything_the_gop_could_tolerate_about_trump.html
There is no saving the Republican Party because the Republican Party died a long time ago, its honor and legacy as the Party of Lincoln tarnished beyond repair by otherwise good and honorable men (ie John McCain) who kneel and kiss the ring of a virulent bigot in the name of party loyalty and self-preservation. Only when their grip on power is threatened do they feel comfortable making a so-called stand. People see through this, and while some will inevitable forget and move on, many will not and the shame and dishonor brought on their name will not simply be washed away with “rebranding efforts” and revamped messaging that sings the same old twisted song.
It would be easy to say that these people have merely forgotten what their party once stood for, and while that’s undeniably true, that in itself would be letting them off the hook. They themselves are reprehensible figures. John McCain, for all the suffering that he has endured and deeply felt respect that he has earned through a difficult and trying life, will end his political career as one among many who cast it aside to capitulate to the likes of Trump.
It’s a story that will write itself in the biographies of many, many Republicans years from now.
Paul Ryan, Mitch McConnell, Peter King, Chris Christie, Orrin Hatch, Marco Rubio, Rand Paul, Hugh Hewitt, and so many, many others. Every one of you in a position to do something knew and you did absolutely nothing.
Regardless as to whatever happens in the future, for the good of the country, the rotting carcass known as the Republican Party needs to be put down. Enough is enough.
Great link Ryan. The author is 100% right. As bad as his mysogynistic bragging was, the refusal to admit the truth about the “Central Park 5” is much worse and deserves more buzz than it’s getting. Trump is quite willing to trash 4th Amendment protections for a whole lot of people, and it’s not coincidence that those people have higher melanin levels. I’ll take what I can get in terms of keeping Trump out of the White House, but it doesn’t speak well of many people that THIS was the final straw.
Fine article, Ryan, but it only appeals to 3 out of 10 Trump supporters…America has a serious problem when people confronted with harsh, accurate information, refuse change their support. We are pretty sick as a nation and these people are gonna be with us long after Trump is history.
“A Politico poll conducted Saturday, one day after the news broke of sexually graphic comments Republican Donald Trump made about women in 2005, shows a strong majority of GOP voters disagree with leaders in their party who want Trump to drop out. Some 74 percent of Republican voters told pollsters Trump should stay in, while just 12 percent said he should step aside. Among GOP women specifically, support for Trump’s exit was only one point higher, at 13 percent. Party strategists believe it will take several more days before the tape, which eight in 10 voters heard about in the first 24 hours of its release, has a substantial effect at the grassroots level.”
Of interest on the graph is that Trump’s favorability suffered the most with the release of the tax return information. That is a “tell” as to what moves voters….his, in particular. The Clinton team should continue to press on this issue as it obviously is the “only” thing that his base responds to.
http://www.politico.com/story/2016/10/politico-morning-consult-poll-229394
I just finished viewing SNL….it was a hoot! Tina Fey, Jimmy Fallon joined the crew for some real current pieces….Fey as Hillary – she deadpans like no one else can…Trump was reprised in his touchy-feely mode….forgetting his was still “live”, of course….I was cracking up…and I don’t recall the name of the blonde actress but she played Kellyanne Conway in an hillarious piece. It’s her “day off”, only, the phone won’t stop ringing…it gets better and better…her spin gets spun and by the end, she’s tellin’ it like it is! Lots of laughs……..
“Conway’s day off” had me laughing so hard that there were tears in my eyes.
The Hill just posted the Conway skit….Here’s a link for those who missed SNL last night….
President Obama’s Economist essay defends capitalism and trade, and tries to explain the rise of protectionism and “crude populism” (http://www.economist.com/news/briefing/21708216-americas-president-writes-us-about-four-crucial-areas-unfinished-business-economic)
Here are some quotes from that damn radical socialist!
“But amid this understandable frustration, much of it fanned by politicians who would actually make the problem worse rather than better, it is important to remember that capitalism has been the greatest driver of prosperity and opportunity the world has ever known.”
“Further progress requires recognising that America’s economy is an enormously complicated mechanism. As appealing as some more radical reforms can sound in the abstract—breaking up all the biggest banks or erecting prohibitively steep tariffs on imports—the economy is not an abstraction. It cannot simply be redesigned wholesale and put back together again without real consequences for real people.”
It’s funny how Obama is much more “conservative” than the GOP, in terms of supporting the status quo with mild reforms and looking at radical ideas with suspicion.
I’ve maintained for years that many Democrats and Independents are more conservative, at least in the old school sense, than today’s Republicans.
Shhhh let’s keep this a secret……don’t want conservatives to abandon capitalism because Obama is “for” it…..
They’re kind of already abandoning it in favor of neomercantilism if Trump is any indication of the future of the GOP.
It is instructive to parse the comments to Obama’s piece. The disrespect and outright disdain for him is sad.
Armchair, there are millions of current Democrats who are much more of a natural fit in the traditional GOp then they are in he Dems, but simply cannot abide by the cesspool of racism and know nothingness it has become.
It’s a negative feedback loop: the GoP needs non thinking know nothings to provide votes for their obviously 1% centric agenda (educated voters wouldn’t so easily vote against their own self interests) who tend to be congregated in the South, and so to get those votes they had to swing hard to the right. This alienates moderate and Centrist Republicans, who at some point cannot abide and eventually defect to the Dems (despite nit being progressives at all). But the loss of the moderates mean the GoP must come HARDER to the right to get more know nothing votes. This causes more defections from the centrists. Repeat this for a few decades, and what you have is an extreme and rigid right wing ideology that permeates the party, and paralyzes it, while the rest of the country looks at this monstrosity that is the GOp and wonders wtf happened? And without the mooring of the ability to compromise and inherent common sense that tends to congregate around the middle of either side, the GOP has become a cauldron of loony tunes. 50 years ago, big parties had their lunatic fringes, but were firmly anchored around their respects centers. This is a good and stable dynamic. Now, all the stable and sane and reasonable centers are concentrated in the democratic party. This is not a sustainable dynamic.
Barrack Obama is a staunch Republican 50 years ago.
The baffling part is, the GoP is mistaken. They don’t NEED to come further to the right to make up for votes leaking over the center line. Forget the Deplorables. This is the same bloc that were forced out by the Dems in the 60’s. Now they’ve destroyed the Republican party. This is a bloc of Confederate racists who think that “one day, the south will rise” and their main job is to keep The Blacks in their place long enough to allow that to happen. America from all sides needs to just ignore this 10-20% of the electorate. They are political parasites, they will feed until they’re removed (like the Dems did) or kill their hosts (like it appears they’re doing with the GoP). But for every deplorable vote the GoP loses by coming back to center right, they will gain one (plus the Dems will lose one) by a traditional center right conservative who comes “back home”.
There is no NEED to continue to pander to the deplorable. They are nihilistic bomb throwers who cannot be near the reins of power in either najor party. Let them go form their own deplorable party and let them circle jerk each other in perpetuity about how “the white man needs to take back his birthright” and all that toxic garbage. Let them do that, while the two adults in the room (thw two major parties) can get back to governing.
Why the outrage now?
May be I have been working under an unvoiced assumption that, like every other human being, a frightened, disappointed, death denying, puzzled and frustrated person resides under my skin.
Unless I accept the observable and use it as a basis of thought, why I am getting old and will die without the possibility of spending any other time in any other place, is unsoluble
Reason tells me the words I just wrote and the thoughts they elicit are logical, indicate a better grip on reality than any of the Sunday sermons I’ve ever heard and unless considered as more likely than eternal reward at the feet of an omnipotent imaginary father figure, actually make sense.
People are catching on to what they see and sense is real and what they have heard and feared all their lives is simply fiction.
Fear leads to lies, greed and power which all tyrants at any social level utilize.
Before Donald Trump’s ascendence to the Republican throne politicians who played the game, especially those seeking the Presidency, covered their tracks, were cut from the squad or simply spent the season on the bench. Thanks to outside influence from the luminaries of talk radio and Fox, fans demanded a third stringer be put in the game. The rest of the contest is yet to be seen, but the guy they demanded isn’t coming out no matter how loud the private boxes and coaching staff demand it.
Politicians of both parties, like their constituents, have been lying to themaselves so long they no longer recognize the truth. Domestic policies favor the wealthy who pull the political puppet’s strings and foreign policy is driven by men whose outdated minds reside in the nineteenth century. The average American has really never been considered as anything, but cannon fodder which is only useful, as the analogy suggests, when the law and order of domestic or foreign war and the money to wage them are needed.
Eventhough, as pointed out in the commentary, voters on the whole don’t wake up until after Labor day, there has been enough background noise that most have a decent idea of who is pulling whose string. The outrage caused by Republican Party lethargy, lack of thought or any other reason why the implosion is taking place may resonate with enough new voters that the elephant could actually be banished by a mouse that is just beginning to roar its’ disgust.
Bernie Sanders’ run generated more energy than either of the candidates and his followers could coalesce to form the third party our youth demands and we desperately need. It is after all their game we are setting up and three of those affected who I know as my sons are not buying either the Democrat’s or Republican’s malarkey,They and their friends with whom I’ve spoken consider both too top heavy to remain upright much longer.
The change is upon us and it won’t take a lot more time to get here.
Much to digest in this post. Chris you hit a very valid point about the pro-life movement. Republican leaders have used that issue as a wedge issue for years. But never do anything practical to reduce the number of abortions. Cutting off access to birth control, cutting off helping mothers with child care, health care and food stamps pushes women towards abortion. Most abortion is a choice women make because they are dirt poor and struggling to take care of the children they already have.
A government making the decision to band abortion can make them mandatory. China made them mandatory and our government has sterilize people with out their consent. A Mormon friend changed my mind years ago. He like me hates abortion but believes letting that be between God and the mother. If you asked Nancy Pelosi if abortion was good and lets have more of them she would say are you crazy. But if you asked her to work with you to make it easier for woman to say no to abortion she would be on-board.
To pro-life people I would urge to put your brain into gear and think this through. The GOP is not your friend in this issue and has been using you for years. If you want to make a real difference, sadly it is much more likely with a democratic party control government. This is not a black and white issue either but comes in shades of gray. Chris wrote about this issue that his wife was put into danger because of stupid inflexible policy. The fact of the matter is when the economy is doing good abortion rates fall off. When times are bad they increase. Over the last 40 years we prosper more under a democratic presidency. I am pro life but believe in different tactics to reduce the number of abortion rather than the scorch earth but actually do nothing policies that Republican politicians pursue. If you believe that Trump cares about this issue or you then I got swamp land for sale for you. Stop emoting and actually think. Hillary’s policies are likely to reduce that number of abortions so if you are intelligent and this issue is important to you , you should vote for her not Trump.
Well said. That is how you deal with tough issues. Meet on the common ground.
I think that there is a greater willingness to find common ground by those who are pro-choice than those who are pro-life. Theirs is an absolute, intolerant belief. I cannot imagine any husband allowing his wife to die in a pregnancy complication that could endanger the fetus. And the continual degradation of women who want to plan their families through contraception is mind-boggling. It’s not just the women who are affected, although they do bear a greater burden, it is the family, including the spouse or partner. I can respect a pro-life view but expect the same for my pro-choice view. That doesn’t happen, hence the stalemate.
Stephen did approach it correctly – with understanding and tolerance and acceptance that it is a personal decision that should belong to the woman primarily.
BTW, add AL Gov. Robert Bentley to the Trump endorsement retractions…You recall Gov. Bentley? He’s the one who was having an affair with his media consultant and his wife found the recordings on his phone? Now, that is the cat calling the kettle black……Really! You’d think he’d have enough sense to keep quiet…..
The religious right’s fanaticism with abortion never really had much to do with abortion at all. Much as racist appeals are cloaked in quote-on-quote “states’ rights”, the real goal here is forcibly turn back the clock to a time when women had very little real control over their bodies and reproductive rights. These people don’t accept and will never acknowledge that their world is over and they’ll do everything within their power to try and bring it back. It’s a foolish and fruitless endeavor, but that doesn’t mean a lot of people won’t be hurt along the way.
It’s unfortunate and even a little bit sad, but there’s no reasoning with these people. What they really want is something they can never have. Same with Trump’s supporters.
I’ve come to this conclusion too, based on the almost unanimous behavior of pretty much every public pro life figure, that being pro life (or, more accurately, anti choice) has very little concern with the lives of babies then it is about punishing women. If it were true concern for the unborn child, then Republicans would be in full agreement of the need to fund programs that ensure a minimum level of basic human care for that child in the form of an adequate social safety net. They would also invest heavily in the only proven tools to bring down abortion: sex education and contraception.
In TX, when they introduced a pilot program that offered free contraception to low income mothers, abortions went down something like 40%. Great news, right?! Not to the TX legislature, who scrapped it cold when it came up for renewal, proving once again that being “pro life” is far more about punishing women for having sex then it is about any real concern for the life of some unborn child. It was far more important deny women a tool they could use to protect themselves against unwanted pregnancy then it was to prevent actual abortions.
I have no doubt that many private individuals, like Stephan, have very sincere convictions against abortion, and I think those are legitimate feelings, even if I don’t agree with them. But when we’re discussing the pro life MOVEMENT, with its public figures, and non profits, and think tanks, and politicians, it’s as appropriate to discuss their “sincere convictions” about the lives of unborn children as it is to discuss the “sincere convictions” that GOP lawmakers have about voter fraud.
In both cases, there is a huge difference what these ppl SAY they believe, and what their ACTIONS suggest they believe.
Very thoughtful, Rob, and I agree.
Mike Pence has just issued a statement coming out against Donald Trump.
I am not generally a man who is given to crude language, but I feel that the only thing that can be said at this moment is “what the fuck?”
Pretty boy just said a naughty word….like, he didn’t know these things about his running mate until just now?
BTW, Sen. John McCain just announced he will not vote for Trump. (Notice – all of these Repubs make the “not vote” statement followed closely with “but I won’t vote for Hillary Clinton…I’ll write in a candidate.”
Republicans – scripted as always.
Not voting for Trump still is a gain for Clinton. Call it half a vote.
Frankly, I look for more Republicans to just not vote for President.
This is exactly what Paul Ryan hoped to avoid all along. Trump’s being hammered on right now, but his supporters will rebound and to say they aren’t happy with a perceived establishment ganging up on their nominee would be an understatement.
Reince Priebus has reportedly decided to cease all funds to the Trump campaign and direct them to saving the House and Senate. Best of luck with that, guy.
From a second hand source, but supposedly from Pence’s FB page:
“Trump won’t win the purity award for sure, but if biblical Christians look back throughout the bible, there were MANY men who fell short of your view of righteousness. How about David….a murderer, adulterer and he was considered a man after God’s own heart. Paul….a killer of Christians. Peter walked with Jesus, but denied he ever knew him.
I guess what I’m saying is that if there was a microphone listening to your life. What would we all hear? Trump’s antics are terrible. He should openly apologize, eat crow and take his lumps. His behavior does not disqualify him from being president though or we’ll have to remove the name of countless other presidents from the books of history if their words or behavior are the barometer for purity and qualification.
Have you ever sinned? Are you worthy of forgiveness? Maybe Trump is as well….or you can sit in the seat of the scoffer and hurl angry words when maybe you should be praying that God changes his heart for the good….might just change your heart as well.”
Here’s the fly in your ointment; Trump isn’t repenting. God forgives, but only after repentance. All those Biblical characters you mention repented. Look at How Trump comports himself. He’s reveled in the seven deadly sins his whole life, and he has no regrets. He groks that people aren’t happy with him right now, but do you really think he thinks that he did anything wrong?? You are embarrassing yourself with these lame rationalizations.
I’m far from perfect, but am I a better human being than Trump? Yes, yes I am.
The Trump website took down Pence’s schedule and when it came back up he had no public appearances until Monday in North Carolina. I guess the Sunday talk shows will be stuck using finger puppets.
If you aren’t there, they can’t ask you any questions……….Should be plenty after Sunday night…..
The GOP rats are deserting this ship in droves, but you can always count on the “value voters” to ignore disgusting behavior in the desperate hope that he will somehow become moral once in office. Let me know how that works for you, Ralph Reed.
“Voters of faith are voting on issues like who will protect unborn life, defend religious freedom, create jobs, and oppose the Iran nuclear deal,” Faith and Freedom Coalition president Ralph Reed said in an email to BuzzFeed News. “Ten-year-old tapes of private conversation with a television talk show host rank very low on their hierarchy of concerns.”
“My personal support for Donald Trump has never been based upon shared values, it is based upon shared concerns about issues such as: justices on the Supreme Court that ignore the constitution, America’s continued vulnerability to Islamic terrorists and the systematic attack on religious liberty that we’ve seen in the last 7 1/2 years,” Perkins [Tony Perkins of the American Family Association] said in an email to BuzzFeed News.
“The comments are obviously disgusting and unfortunate,” Bauer said in an interview with BuzzFeed News. “But Donald Trump did not run as a evangelical or as somebody who ran the kind of campaign that a Pat Robertson would run.”
https://www.buzzfeed.com/rosiegray/prominent-evangelicals-still-backing-trump-after-graphic-vid?utm_term=.mcENkBGJx#.irkDW9ZvN
I have become so cynical of these faith leaders…First, that they would so actively pursue political activities instead of focusing their time and resources on their flock, and, second, that their allegiance is not driven by common moral values as a first and incontrovertible requirement. Frankly, they disgust me.
I know Mime. It’s almost as if these ppl are just con men with no real interest in the scriptures or Jesus teachings, who are only concerned with their own naked ambitions…….
“Ten-year-old tapes of private conversation with a television talk show host rank very low on their hierarchy of concerns.”
On this point I absolutely agree with Reed, but not for the same reasons. As I posted on the previous discussion, things like his unfitness to be CIC and his ignorance of other countries, how economics works outside his own narrow interests, and diplomacy rank much higher than his crude speech.
I would suggest that Reed, Perkins, et al. consult their Bibles and find the part where the Devil was trying to tempt Jesus with dominion over all the earthly kingdoms. There’s a lesson there if you guys care to learn it.
Here’s an interesting backstory of the release of the Access Hollywood video. Per a comment at the end, this may be the only video of its kind………
http://money.cnn.com/2016/10/07/media/access-hollywood-donald-trump-tape/index.html
Fly, as a general rule I’d agree with you. There are many valid reasons to oppose Trump: he has the temperament of a spoiled six-year-old, knows nothing about anything, cares nothing about anyone but himself, and his entire campaign consists of giving the middle finger to anyone his supporters hate. But even if that wasn’t true, I couldn’t stand the national embarrassment of behavior like that.
On NPR, the distinguished Mr. Reed said he would indeed trust his daughters alone in the company of tRump, saying in effect they were “raised right.”
That’s like putting the emPHAsis on the wrong syLABle, doncha think?
The man sounds like a predator.
Makes perfect sense Bobo. Only women not “raised right” are at risk of sexual assault. If women are assaulted, it’s their fault. Good girls don’t get sexually assaulted, of course.
Here’s what Trump’s advisor, Michael Caputo, is telling him to do at the Sunday Town Hall:
“Michael Caputo, a former Trump campaign adviser, said he was encouraging the Trump team to immediately make an issue of former president Bill Clinton’s womanizing past and “allegations of sexual crimes.”
“In order to blunt this really bad story — and make no mistake, this is DEFCON One — they need to pull the Clintons into the same mire where Clinton has dumped him, because in fact they do exist there,” Caputo said. “They’ve got to go nuclear. That’s all they have left.”
Sounds like Trump’s going out swinging….I am not surprised. Be sure your children are anywhere but in front of the TV during this town hall.
I just learned that CNN released Howard Stern radio interviews of Trump in which lewd comments were made. He has quite a long history of sexual commentary…Guess more and more tapes/video will pop up…Is there no end to them?
http://www.cnn.com/2016/10/08/politics/trump-on-howard-stern/index.html
No 1mime, there will be no end to them. It was reported last summer (2015) that other GOP hopefuls had done no background (digging the dirt) research on Trump, but the DNC had been compiling a file on him for two years. Early voting is just starting. Expect more, including the “hours” of audio of Trump on Howard Stern’s show that CNN just happened to find today.
It ain’t gonna be pretty.
“It ain’t gonna be pretty.”
No, it won’t, but it couldn’t happen to a nicer guy.
Looks like there’s a lot more, which makes sense. NBC likely has hundreds or thousands of hours of raw footage from when scenes wernt necessarily be g filmed, and so Trump would just be his usual self.
http://www.rawstory.com/2016/10/fox-news-hosts-trump-waiting-for-more-bombshells-to-come-they-will-drip-them-out/
Anderson Cooper: “Welcome to our second Presidential debate. Secretary Clinton, the first question is to you.”
Random town hall participant: “Secretary Clinton, why should the American people vote for you?
Hillary: “Thank you for having me here, and thank you for that question. I would like to cede the remainder of my time to Mr. Trump.”
Anderson Cooper: “Uh….Madam Secretary, I don’t think you can do that. You get the first question, and then we alternate questions the rest of the evening.”
Hillary: “Anderson, I don’t think you understand. I’m ceding all of my speaking time tonight to Donald. I’m just going to sit over here is smile, probably laugh occasionally, and think about how I’m going to make Paul Ryan dance like a marionette”.
….make Paul Ryan dance like a marionette, and Mitch McConnell a has been…..
Thisbis probably more or less what will be on SNL tonight.
“Anderson Cooper: “Welcome to our second Presidential debate. Secretary Clinton, the first question is to you.”
Random town hall participant: “Secretary Clinton, why should the American people vote for you?
Hillary: “Thank you for having me here, and thank you for that question. I would like to cede the remainder of my time to Mr. Trump.”
Anderson Cooper: “Uh….Madam Secretary, I don’t think you can do that. You get the first question, and then we alternate questions the rest of the evening.””
Oddly enough, very nearly that same thing happened, except Trump then threw it back “No after you, I’m a gentleman.” What a weird, weird moment.
I do agree with Rob that Trump offered no specifics, didn’t stay on point, and per fact checkers, made outlandish and incorrect statements. Hillary at least tried to respond. I wish she had nailed him on points that were obviously untrue but this was a very difficult debate scenario.
The optics I think favored Clinton, hands down. The only way Trump gets positives is because he did better than he did in debate #1. He did handle the compliment well, I’ll give him that.
T’s Aleppo comments praising Russia, Assad, Iran under the guise of going after ISIL was awful. His comments about appointing an investigator to go after Clinton is unprecedented. His deflection on the sex tape without apology was horrid.
Guess where I am headed is that Trump is unfit and nothing has changed in that regard.
This one tweet perfectly encapsulates the “dammed if you do, damned of you don’t” conundrum the GOP finds itself, and why they are, as the French say, “Le f**Ked”
So it begins.
Willful ignorance is hard to accept.
Looks like it’s official: as the old saying goes, once you lose the Tic Tac endorsement, you’ve lost it all.
Someday, if I play my cards right, the marketing executives at Tic Tac will need to issue a statement about me.
Count on it, Chris!
Oh, man! First Skittles, now Tic Tac! Geez!
That’s the original rainbow coalition.
Looks like Hillary’s debate prep got a lot easier.
No need to attack Trump. His unfavourable are as low as they will possibly go. Now’s the time to plug your own policies, time and time again. Nobody but the truly irredeemable deplorables WANT to vote for Trump anymore. Time to give them an excuse to want to vote for you, because you know they’re desperately looking for one.
The deplorables are asking some of the same questions Chris did, although from the RWNJ perspective (warning, it’s getting crazy):
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/3478098/posts
The Bush family leaked this!!!!! ROTFLMAO!!!!!!
I could feel sorry for the Trump die-hards, except that they chose poorly, and personal responsibility, and such.
I frankly don’t understand Fly what possible relevance it is WHO leaked it and why.
Undoubtedly the leak was done to hurt Trump politically. That is both obvious, and no different then has been going on since politics has existed.
But who cares? Does it in any way change the relevance of the content of the leak?
Truth is truth. I have no doubt that if such a tape existed for Hillary, it would/will be released. But also think about this; Donald Trump has spent his life hurting and hitting on little people. Why wouldn’t someone in the editing room or wherever who knew about the existence of this tape make it public?
Trump has lived by the sword. He will die by the sword. Karma.
A bit of marital disclosure advice from the LA Times for Hillary should Trump throw this out at her. I think it is the right way for Hillary to respond. It’s time. Do some good with your experience for other women. There’s also some interesting advice on how Hillary should work on her outreach to millennials who are not moving in her direction.
“Clinton should also talk about her husband’s infidelity. It’s no secret that Bill Clinton is a serial adulterer, writes Virginia Heffernan, and besides, being married to an unfaithful spouse is something to which millions of Americans can relate. She writes: “If, in the next debate, Donald Trump ventures to ask Hillary Clinton about her husband’s infidelities, I hope she’ll see this not as an attack to be tightly parried but as a lob to be smashed. I hope she’ll see how breaking her silence can help the many women and men who may grieve yet steadfastly refuse to blame themselves, seek their own happiness, and flourish in spite of marital betrayal.”
http://www.latimes.com/opinion/readersreact/la-ol-opinion-newsletter-hillary-clinton-millennials-20161008-snap-htmlstory.html
I’m just laughing at their excuses, Rob. But I do hope that these fools are all talk and no action. It might not be possible to make a legal case against Trump if some of them decide to express their disapproval of an election loss with violence. But I have no doubts that he would be morally responsible, with all his irresponsible talk of rigged elections.
What I hope to see is that he gets crushed in the election, then crushed in all these pending lawsuits. Let him be broke and have to work for Ivanka.
One of the Republican pundits last night (around midnight) spoke about this…saying HRC just should ignore all this as the damage has been done. What she recommended was that when HRC walks out on the floor, that she NOT shake Trump’s hand. Why dignify his candidacy. Don’t make a big deal out of it, just say, “Hello, Donald”……………
I can’t see anything worthwhile coming out of the GOP even after Trump’s loss. In fact I’m trying to think of a single good stance the GOP supports and am coming up short. Not that it really matters anymore. When you’re party is this morally decrepit and bigoted it doesn’t matter what your tax policy is, you can’t be in charge of the government.
They can’t even make actual critiques of their favorite whipping boy, “political correctness”, because A) they seem to use that phrase to refer to just basic decency not one of the three actual PC movements (people like Jon Chait and Scott Alexander manage to criticize actual political correctness without being raging bigots, it’s not that hard to do yet the GOP still can’t do it) and B) the party is so intellectually brain dead their “critiques” are of the “You mad bro” Alt-Right variety. I hope this party implodes.
Yep, the GOP is opposing free trade???!!! And, over-rode a veto without serious study of the reasons? And, continue to offer one after another attack on womens’ rights and voting rights?
There are some good people in the Republican Party but they are being completely shut down in terms of leadership (Jeff Flake). The circle of wagons is complete.
I’m still confused though, was Donald Trump’s pussy grabbing of binders full of women not a legitimate rape?
Because GOPers seem to be acting like this situation is unprecedented…
I don’t think they know the difference, formdib………
The GOP circle is tightening:
(1) Trump apology (?!);
(2) selective un-endorsements (but few saying they won’t ‘vote’ for him if you notice;
(3) trot out the wife (“Melania Trump on Saturday said she was offended by her husband’s sexually aggressive comments about women but that she hoped the American voters would forgive him. “The words my husband used are unacceptable and offensive to me,” Melania Trump said in a statement. “This does not represent the man that I know. He has the heart and mind of a leader. I hope people will accept his apology, as I have, and focus on the important issues facing our nation and the world.”
http://www.politico.com/story/2016/10/melania-trump-urges-voters-to-accept-gop-nominees-apology-229367
(4) Accuse Bill and Hillary of being MUCH worse;
(5) Arrange photo-ops with people with bowed hands saying words……
(6) Call Putin.
Cynical? You betcha!
Don’t know how much editorial discretion you have at Forbes, Chris, and far be it from me to give advice on what pieces you submit there.
But I, personally, think this post, or one like it, needs to find its way to a large, mainstream, conservative leaning publication. Like, oh I don’t know, Forbes Magazine.
Sunlight is the best disinfectant and if there is any hope for the GOP, all the dirty laundry needs to be aired out. The time for spin and putting a good face on things is over. There is nothing else that can be said to save the GoP other then “we don’t know how we got to this, but we lost our way, and we’re not going to rest until we get back to our roots” and firmly and without ambiguity, disown/purge the Deplorables from the party. Not just Trumpkins, but the tea party types, the Ted Cruz types, the Louie Gohmert types etc.
I forgot to add: it is crucial if the GoP intends to save itself and remain one of the two major political parties that Trump NOT be treated like some out-of-LF anamoly. There is a DIRECT link from the anti science, anti intellectual, conspiracy theory wingnuttery the GoP has become over the past few decades and the man who now heads the ticket. He didn’t come out of the ether. Toxic leaders like this do not emerge out of otherwise healthy organizations.
There’s a Bible verse in Matthew that I think underscores this point:
“Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves. 16 By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? 17 Likewise, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. 18 A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit. 19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20 Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them.”
– Matthew Chapter 7, verse 15-20
The passage is specifically referring to the “fruit” as a person’s deeds. It is also just as relevant to organizations. “A good tree bears good fruit, a bad one bears bad fruit”. Donald Trump is as rotten a piece of fruit as you can get. He could not be borne by the Tree of the GoP unless the tree itself was diseases and rotten.
Rob,
if i may add my favorie:
Mathew 25:45
“He will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.’
Justanoterhuman — I was glad to see that many Evangelical leaders cited that verse (Matthew 25:45) as a reason no one should vote for Trump. They posted this petition before Friday’s “revelation” (which as Chris noted wasn’t news to anyone paying attention).
https://www.change.org/p/donald-trump-a-declaration-by-american-evangelicals-concerning-donald-trump
Means – This is a powerful, substantive statement by the undersigned evangelical groups and individuals. I think we can all agree with its message and purpose. Thank you for the link – I have shared it. This is the spirit with which the evangelical movement was birthed. Sadly, too many evangelical groups have become pawns of those with different visions.
This is a well written piece that asks more questions of those who support Trump and advocate living as the Bible directs. More and more we are laying bare the contradictions between how one “lives” their lives and what they “say” they stand for.
http://www.salon.com/2016/10/08/crisis-of-faith-donald-trumps-revelations-and-the-hypocrisy-of-the-christian-right/?source=newsletter
Respectfully, Rob, what the Forbes conservative readership needs is not an “I told you so” post. What they need is a bare bones “this is what the Republican Party has created and here is how they did it” post. We here are far more sophisticated in our understanding of how the Trump phenomenon came to be than most people. We also realize that the GOPe has exhibited zero, read that ZERO desire to make any substantive changes. Remember, when Romney lost to Obama in ’12, there was an project that looked deeply into why they lost and what the party needed to do to improve. The GOPe ignored it. Why? They were winning without it and they didn’t want to rock the boat. Well, they just met the “mother” of all tidal waves in DJT and they have another chance to initiate change from within. If they choose once again to take the easy path, they don’t deserve to survive.
That’s what Republicans who think need to read.
Great post, and you’re absolutely right that Trump’s role in railroading (and calling for the death of) the Central Park Five is even worse.
I’m going to offer a counter-position to “Politically, this means that a very large chunk of the support Clinton leveraged to reach the White House will have evaporated by Inauguration Day.” though.
Hillary Clinton has always been more popular *in* an office than she is while campaigning for one. Frankly, I think it’s a low-level misogyny that considers a woman seeking power “shrill” or “bitchy”. Once she’s *doing* the job, no problem. Recall, at some point during her time as SecState, she was essentially tied for “most admired woman in the world”. It’s certainly true that as President she’ll face a worse opposition than she did as SecState, so it will not be all sunshine and roses, but it won’t fall apart before Inauguration Day.
I think the really interesting story between Election Day and Inauguration Day will be the status of Merrick Garland’s nomination.
Greg, the secret to many men’s success are competent women – in the office and at home. I hope more women will aspire for political office where their ability to work more towards consensus will benefit the functioning of government, and for leading roles in business and on Boards of directors. Women offer a valuable p.o.v. and as their numbers increase due to natural life span longevity, they will be more numerous and able to participate more effectively and fairly across the spectrum.
What mystifies me about the men in the Republican party is don’t any of them have wives, daughters, girlfriends? Why don’t the females in the party revolt?
Unfortunately many women go along with sexism.
Most of the Republican couples I know the wife is all in. Let me say that while I do not pretend to be smarter than they are, I do not think they do any independent analysis on political matters. Most have worked very little if at all outside the home (which is not unusual in my senior generation…I was an outlier in this regard…I liked working – earning money – the competitive aspect – being my own person…the whole bit, but did raise our children first.)
For many Republican women, it is the religion part of it. Never mind the contradictions between belief and actions, that is what they are comfortable with. For younger women, who are better educated and used to greater diversity, and who deeply believe in equality of opportunity and pay, they are less forgiving. Hence, the age stratification within the base.
I can’t remember who said this, but it was originally in response to the question of why Bridgegate stuck to Chris Christie after all the other scandals never did: “Never do something rotten that the ordinary person can understand.”
Good one, ARchetrix….to which I’d add: never do anything rotten that your enemies will have an incentive to explore….
Thanks for continuing to provide thoughtful, nuanced commentary about this election. I totally agree with your thoughts on empathy. Hope some people in the GOP are able to listen to people like you and rescue the party from the idiots.
Thank you. #breathoffreshair
Overshadowed in the Trump firestorm is Wikileaks latest HRC reveal (timing, guys, timing!):
http://www.bbc.com/news/election-us-2016-37595047
So does this tell us anything about her that we didn’t already know or suspect? Do we have elitism here? Indeed we do. But if my choice is elitism or the ignorant incompetent dumpster fire on a train wreck in the middle of a s$&@storm that is Trump, I’ll take elitism.
If that’s their big reveal, then bye, thanks for playing.
Oh, and by the way (cue the total surprise) get ready to discover that much of this new wikileaks dump was forged. Here’s a preview from a month ago, but we’re starting to get trickles of this on twitter now regarding forged/altered podesta emails.
http://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2016/09/hacking-forgeries/499775/
Wow, thanks for sharing that, Chris. Nothing is sacred anymore. I’m thinking all those electronic voting machines may be attractive targets as well.
I don’t think the voting machines are online. The one good thing about our voting system is how decentralized it is. You’d have to hack precinct by precinct.
Fly, Pres. Obama announced this week that 40 states have requested help to combat cyber-vote intrusions. I don’t know “how” it is done (other than the old fashioned way – millions of illegals stealing the election voting for dead people (-; ) but evidently it is a concern.
Last night Trump supporters including Michelle Bachman said they thought the Trump tape was dropped as a political move to counteract the Wilileaks dump, but I’m hearing it might have been the other way around. “Somebody” contacted the WaPo reporter with the Trump tape, and he contacted the Trump campaign for comments at about 1:30 p.m. They asked for a copy, which he provided. They responded with the first apology. Then the Wiki dump happened about 1 1/2 hours later. Who knows what phone calls were made and to whom.
I agree. The timing is too auspicious and we know there is a direct line between the T campaign and Assange (and Putin).
Archetex, wikileaks dumped the emails very soon after the Trump revelation. It was almost certainly connected to the Trump thing, and probably done as a response.
Man, Assange has totally discredited wikileaks this cycle as a invaluable, non partisan whistle blower organization of the type that does have huge value. Assange has exposed himself as a deranged partisan hack. Worst of all, he discredits his entire philosophy.
Anybody who says they are truly interested in freedom of information, and opposition to tyrannical government but who desperately wants Trump to become POTUS betrays themselves as a liar, a fool, or both. Trump is a specific person, yes. He is also an archetype, let’s call it the “authoritarian dictator” archetype. If he were Filipino, he’d be as bad or worse as Duterte. If he were Russian, he’d be as bad or worse as Putin. If he were Zimbabwean, he’d be as bad or worse as Mugabe. The idea that government corruption should always be exposed and that information should always be free is 100% incompatible with the belief that Donald Trump should be president of the United States of America.
It’s shocking to me because I had always assumed wikileaks was a radical leftist organization. Certainly, the vast majority of WL’s supporters are left leaning. If Assange wanted to totally delegitimize wikileaks, he couldn’t have done a better job then he’s doing.
Assange better like being inside, ’cause he isn’t leaving anytime soon.
Mime, one wonders if perhaps Ecuador may find Assange to be overstaying his welcome. Trumps popularity cannot he very high in any Hispanic country. Perhaps the ppl of Ecuador might take exception to his continued presence there.
Flypusher, about voting machines, many of them are set up with a central data gathering site that does not have sufficient safeguards. Some are designed to permit a man-in-the-middle attack, contrary to all principles of data security.
And of course the software for the machines is designed centrally — and in many cases it is impossible to verify the results. So no precinct-by-precicnct effort is require to commit voting fraud by voting machine.
Do you remember when Wikileaks was relevant? It feels so long ago now.
To echo Chris’ point, somehow denigrating, insulting, attacking, dismissing, and hating on EVERY DAMN minority in the country for over a year (and all his life) wasn’t good enough to banish him to the dustbin of history Hell but it took graphically, profanely, disgustingly, and incontrovertibly in his own voice misogyny of White women that we ALL already knew was out there in the open (because you know ol’ massa ain’t interested in know darkie women, as other White women have pointed out) to put that final nail in the coffin?
I’m not impressed. Just relieved. And still extremely disgusted and disappointed. Not at Trump. But with this fucking country and our “lovely” citizens. Not all. Just 40 – 48% of them roughly speaking and a FAR higher percentage of the White electorate.
As I noted in Chris’ previous blog, shades of David Duke’s Louisiana governor’s run in 1991 where he won 55% of the White vote but luckily/thankfully still lost to a Democratic convicted felon.
And it has gotten worse since. Thankfully Grand Wizard wannbe Trump wasn’t as smart, slick, and disciplined as Duke was, and is too misogynistic, thin skinned, petty, immature, insecure, and irrational to withstand the scrutiny of the national spotlight he so coveted.
We WERE that close to a Trump Presidency before he self immolated. And he WILL still get at least 40% of the popular vote despite all this non stop disgusting hate revelations already revealed ad nauseum. And still more to be disclosed.
We are NOT at a good place in this country right now. For all our old people generational disdain for the Millennials and other sundry “young, dumb punks”, they are our best hope for the future.
Not us for sure.
WW
I will give Trump credit for one thing- he has never tried to hide what he truly is. To put it politely, he’s a crude, obnoxious, self-centered bully, he’s always been a crude, obnoxious, self-centered bully, and he’s not going to stop being a crude, obnoxious, self-centered bully. It’s a sad fact of life that if you’re lucky enough to be born wealthy, many people are willing to overlook the fact that you are a crude, obnoxious, self-centered bully. We may be spared the shame seeing of this disgusting person in the office of President, but there is still the shame of him getting this far.
Anyone who reads this blog and still believes Trump is better than Clinton – what can you say?
In the SamWang link Fair Economist provided, I went to Wang’s Princeton Election Consortium website for more reading. He is definitely worth following. HEre’s a book he recommends to better understand why this political #**tstorm is happening.
Ratf**ked: How the Democrats Won the Presidency but Lost America, by Daley, David –
The explosive account of how Republican legislators and political operatives fundamentally rigged our American democracy through redistricting.
“With Barack Obama’s historic election in 2008, pundits proclaimed the Republicans as dead as the Whigs of yesteryear. Yet even as Democrats swooned, a small cadre of Republican operatives, including Karl Rove, Ed Gillespie, and Chris Jankowski began plotting their comeback with a simple yet ingenious plan. These men had devised a way to take a tradition of dirty tricks?known to political insiders as “ratf**king”?to a whole new, unprecedented level. Flooding state races with a gold rush of dark money made possible by Citizens United, the Republicans reshaped state legislatures, where the power to redistrict is held. Reconstructing this never- told-before story, David Daley examines the far-reaching effects of this so-called REDMAP program, which has radically altered America’s electoral map and created a firewall in the House, insulating the party and its wealthy donors from popular democracy. Ratf**ked pulls back the curtain on one of the greatest heists in American political history. ”
Sounds like it would be worth our time and money to read.
States can undo gerrymandering. Florida did with a state constitutional amendment and much legal fighting by the League of Woman Voters. Thanks ladies.
Yes, it is possible through dificult court challenges or through demographic changes that affect the census. It will take time since gerrymandering is so entrenched, but it’s worth the effort.
Note to self: record SNL tonight!
NO KIDDING! I hope they’re “quick” studies!
Trump sez he’s NOT quitting:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/amid-growing-calls-to-drop-out-trump-vows-to-never-withdraw/2016/10/08/8c0b5b7a-8d68-11e6-bff0-d53f592f176e_story.html?ICID=ref_fark&utm_content=link&utm_medium=website&utm_source=fark
“People are calling and saying, ‘Don’t even think about doing anything else but running,” Trump said when asked about Republican defections. “You have to see what’s going on. The real story is that people have no idea about the support. I don’t know how that’s going to boil down, but people have no idea about the support.”
I wonder how many of those people are Dems?
Chris, you’ve got no excuse for not knowing Hillary’s tax plans. And no, *you* aren’t going to be paying more in taxes, unless you’re going to inherit from a multimillion dollar estate. Hillary’s been upfront with fairly detailed proposals on lots of issues- we do know what she’s going to ask Congress for. We don’t know what Congress will pass, but that’s not under her control (and we all know that, even if many Americans don’t).
Agree. I never planned to vote for Trump but I read his tax plans – the first one and the revision. That’s the only way to become informed – is by study and comparison. I concur that she’s been upfront and for a very long time. There is no excuse for informed people who care about tax policy to support her without knowing what her tax policies (and other policies) are. I know this is hard for Chris but agree he needs to do this. After all, that’s what he would advise us to do if there were a GOP candidate of note.
Does anyone here think that Trump is in any way truly sorry for what he said/did or really thinks that he did anything wrong? As a rich alpha male, it’s his RIGHT to grope women!! Hell, they ought to be flattered that he deigned to notice them.
Here’s a fantastic breakdown of Trump’s statement:
https://mobile.twitter.com/leahmcelrath/status/784614267383386112
Yes, for those who hadn’t figured him out already….I doubt his core base will change their minds. It would say something about them to do so. About their ability to make good decisions, to face their own racism and sexist views. Let us hope that the enlightened ones will vote in overwhelming numbers. The Republican Party has to be crushed as it will not admit that they share the basic views Trump blathers. Couch it in indignation, shock, but this is the crop they’ve sown. Change it or accept the consequences.
Sez VP candidate and Trump running mate Pence:
“I am grateful that he has expressed remorse and apologized to the American people. We pray for his family and look forward to the opportunity he has to show what is in his heart when he goes before the nation tomorrow night.”
I am fairly sure that Trump “wishes” the video was never released. I am also sure that he regrets that he “got caught saying the things that he did”, but I do not believe Donald Trump will ever change. He has no moral core. He preys on weaker people. He enjoys hurting others. That is not the mark of either a “good” businessman or a presidential candidate.
No, he will mouth platitudes for people like Pence and others whose faith somehow allows them to overlook decades of immorality because his heart is now repentent? If so, let him spend the rest of his life making up to all the people he hurt, but let him do so on his nickle and his time in his tower. He is a disgrace.
Talk is cheap. If you are truly offended by Trump’s lack of morals you will not associate with him.
I could feel sorry for Pence, but he knew what he was getting into. Trump’s been a big jerk all his adult life.
Timing, Ted Cruz, timing…
Timing isn’t the real problem, it is fundamental weakness and need for power. This endorsement by Cruz was never about supporting Trump, it was always about positioning Cruz. He deserves to be felled by his own sword.
Sorry, just pointing and laughing.
Yeah, guess we’ve gotta find something to laugh about in this election (-;
Yup. John Kasich in my opinion has the inside track in the aftermath of this Trump fever-nightmare to take take the top spot in 4 years. Pence as of today is still covered in Trump ectoplasm.
Teddy boy (as always) in his efforts to ascend politically has successfully alienated everyone.
No presidential nomination for you!
Mag,
I respectfully disagree. what makes you think the people who voted for Trump are leaving the country. The republican party is still the party of tax cuts for billionaires, discussions about legitimate/forcable rape, climate change deniers, voter suppression, the list goes on and on!
if i had to bet, Cruz will be the frontrunner!
The best of the Bushes. Thanks Billy Bush, you and your crass/locker room/frat-like interview skills are amazing. Long may cover entertainment news.
The irony of this all is so unbelievable it borders on magical realism.
And Scottie, just STFU and quit while you’re behind. You can either be concerned about your daughter seeing/hearing bad things, or you can support Trump. Pick one.
Ooops, that was supposed to be in response to Ms. Navarro’s totally righteous smackdown of the Trump lickspittles.
Ms. Navarro is making a name for herself. What I cannot understand is why she’s a Republican.
“Ms. Navarro is making a name for herself. What I cannot understand is why she’s a Republican.”
Perhaps for the same reasons Chris was?
No Ana Navarro is a typical right wing partisan who just happened to be Hispanic. I have seen her on the Sunday morning news shows for years and she spewed the usual wingnut crap. Until Trump came along and attacked the Hispanics openly in uncoded language.
Just like the old Holocaust/Jewish parable, she turned a blind eye to/joined in on all the right wing Republican hate. Until it was turned on HER and her “kind”. I’m not impressed.
Just like Nancy Reagan didn’t give a damn about stem cell research until dear ole Ronnie came down with Alzheimer’s. THEN she was a “tireless champion” of stem call research. It’s all about them and them only. No empathy whatsoever about “the others”.
“Just like Nancy Reagan didn’t give a damn about stem cell research until dear ole Ronnie came down with Alzheimer’s. THEN she was a “tireless champion” of stem call research. It’s all about them and them only. No empathy whatsoever about “the others”.”
Take what you can get. Someone joining your side, even for reasons you don’t like or respect, is still someone joining your side. Whatever Ms Navarro’s political past, or motives for going on offense against Trump, right now GOPers calling him out carry more weight than Dems calling him out.
If the Republican Party really wants to do something positive for its base, it will provide voter swimming classes for the rising sea levels and free passes on Tesla’s Mars mission…gotta get away from all that heat!
This just in from Politico re: RNC: “In an email from the RNC to a victory program mail vendor, with the subject line “Hold on all projects,” the committee asked the vendor to “put a hold” on mail production. “Please put a hold/stop on all mail projects right now. If something is in production or print it needs to stop. Will update you when to proceed,”
Maybe Chris will explain more about what this entails…
Another example, Bubba, is that even to this day, the list of GOP politicians who are unambiguously supportive of gay rights are those that have gay kids themselves. Thats it.
Anybody think Duck Cheney would be as supportive if LGBT issues if his daughter (who is herself deplorable in pretty much every other issue) wasnt a lesbian?
The disease isnt Trump. He’s just a symptom. The disease is conservatism
It’s conservatism as it has evolved, Rob. I believe there was a time when the Republican Party was a better party – neither is pristeen – but what they have become is totally by their choice.
Just saw that Sen Ayotte un-endorsed Trump. She’s going to write-in Pence. Too little, too late. I hope the Trump cultists in NH don’t vote for her.
Um… she’s a sucka for even entertaining the idea days ago that he is a worthy role model to children. More like an example of the kind of potential sex offender children should stay away from.
When he said those things he was already a grandpa. Bill Kristol said it perhaps best recently, “He’s a dirty old man.”
Yep, Ayotte’s not going to be able to stick that Trump support comment back in the can…and Hassan will blow it up…nice and big….after all, the fundamental lack of judgement that prompted Ayotte’s support for Trump should be looked at for what it was – party over country.
Hassan will run with it and Trump’s cultists in NH are gonna be pissed off! As a political move it really doesn’t make a lot of sense to me, but maybe this is someone whose conscience just couldn’t take anymore of the hypocrisy.
We HAVE to defeat her Senate bid to get the numbers we need to retake Senate. Have to.
Ayotte will not win the senate race.
I’m not sure how many of you have heard of Sam Wang, but he is the non commercial cousin of 538’s Nate Silver. He doesn’t care about click bait journalism and he predicted the 2012 election with 100% accuracy.
Here’s what he has to say about the presidential race (Trump is done), and the Senate race (Dems will likely have 52-53 majority).
http://election.princeton.edu/2016/10/08/what-color-is-the-swan/#more-17785
Was not aware of Wang. Thanks for link and info, Pedneuro.
Wang is great, but he does prefer Democrats, and it biases his predictions. Most of the time he’s spot on, but not always. He’s better that Silver, who has ridiculously wide error bars and often isn’t making much of a “prediction”, but not perfect.
Fair economist, I don’t think anyone is 100% perfect or unbiased.
“Just saw that Sen Ayotte un-endorsed Trump. She’s going to write-in Pence”
Writing in Pence is the ballot equivalent of the “We don’t think Trump is REALLY going to build the wall, he’s just saying he will to attract racists. We’re not racists, we’re just trying to be gentle with them!”
Although sounding on surface like a form of strategy between keeping to your party and also to your country, it doesn’t really change the fact that Pence is a social conservative apologizer in chief for the exact bile Trump spews from his face.
If you really want distance from Trump, you don’t vote for his lower lip to spite his tongue. Either way you’re gonna get covered in whatever mucilage grumbles up from his rotten viscera.
Don’t forget all the head shaking and “no, no’s” and denials from Pence during the debate. He’s complicit. Don’t feign surprise now. Man up.
This exchange/clip is an instant classic for the ages. Please check it out this link guys.
Ava Navarro… unleashed!
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/10/08/please-stop-saying-that-word-a-cnn-panel-for-the-ages/?tid=pm_politics_pop_b
To me the “pro-life” faction is a collective of people who share a mass psychosis. Why the rabid interest in fetuses when there are so many more pressing concerns? They ignore evidence that making abortion illegal doesn’t stop the abortions therefore it must be a deep seated misogyny and the need to “slut shame” women for daring to have an active sex life. They also ignore evidence that many anti-abortionists will seek one out in a heartbeat if it’s one them or their own family.They ignore the fact that most Republican politicians have no real interest in overturning Roe vs. Wade, despite their talk, and those politicians themselves have paid for abortions themselves and I’m willing to be money Trump has paid for a few.
I admire people who are against abortion who actually adopt special needs kids or other unwanted children. The ones I don’t respect are the ones who just shriek and scream about it but when asked how many they’ve adopted say “who, me?”
That was supposed to go under Flypusher at the bottom. Sorry. 🙂
The pro-life people I reject are those who scream “life” yet fight against contraception, welfare for women who become pregnant and even would allow a woman to die during a pregnancy complication.
Yep. Your priority can be “saving babies” or shaming women. Pick one.
This morning Jack Kingston (R-GA) was trying to defend Trump. His talking points were: “Trump’s not the same man today that he was when he was in show business.” “He’s now surrounded by spiritual leaders who can advise him.” “The GOP has to win (no matter what) in order to have control of SCOTUS nominations.” The third reason is the real truth in my opinion. They want another Scalia pronto.
Good luck with getting the new site up Chris. I’ve thought of you more than once recently when I’ve read others describe themselves as being politically orphaned. David Brooks even used the term.
http://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2016/10/8/13207434/trump-audio-ryan-mcconnell
I don’t expect any of them to un-endorse Trump now, for the same reason they didn’t un-endorse Trump before or try to block his nomination. They have no chance to hold the Senate, and could even lose the House if they angered Trump’s cult following.
I have to ask, who in their right mind votes for a presidential candidate that repulses his own running mate and is unable to convince their party’s top ranking member (who is Speaker of The House) to appear with him in public?
This is really a truly bonkers situation. We have news networks given parental warnings and showing censored clips of an individual running for president of a major party.
Say what you will about Hillary, she still has the unambiguous support of most of her party, probably even more today in the wake of this latest revelation about Trump.
Mr. Ladd just days ago said Trump is toast. I had my doubts that his throngs of supporters would abandon him on election day (some are still pounding away at his critics on blogs even this morning).
But right now as far as “toast” is concerned, I can almost smell the burnt bread crumbs of the morning of November 9th. Ladd’s prediction is looking increasingly more like prophecy.
I think all of us need to remember what happened when Roger Ailes was forced out at Fox News and how the floodgates opened to stories of women being harassed and abused.
A similar phenomenon will probably occur with Trump. It looks like my own Trump/Bill Cosby comparison this past week may prove right on the nose.
He has been doing this clearly for decades. There are women out there that will feel it is now safe(r) for them to talk.
If I was a sitting GOP elected official up for re-election this November, now is the time to flee.
Don’t be the last rat.
>] A similar phenomenon will probably occur with Trump. It looks like my own Trump/Bill Cosby comparison this past week may prove right on the nose.”
Of course. Curiously, no one knows for sure just how this video was leaked, but it was almost assuredly the Clinton campaign. The only real mystery here is just how 16 Republicans in the primary, some with money aplenty, couldn’t find this. Seriously, that’s political malpractice if I’ve ever seen it. And the worst is, as you said, likely still to come.
Hold onto your butts.
This morning I heard it was someone from within NBC. Access Hollywood was already in the process of producing a piece about the video, and someone jumped the gun.
Last night, Joy Reid told Michelle Bachman this exact thing: why didn’t the GOP invest the time and money to research Trump for things like this?
“The only real mystery here is just how 16 Republicans in the primary, some with money aplenty, couldn’t find this. Seriously, that’s political malpractice if I’ve ever seen it.”
1) They didn’t take Trump seriously.
2) They thought that by going easy on Trump they could snap up his fan base after he dropped out.
3) They thought they had sufficiently poisoned Clinton’s chances so that they could.not.lose. against.”her”.
I hesitate to ever predict election results but it’s not looking to good for Trump. His die hard base is ignorant but Trump is so unpopular with minorities and women that I think we can easily speculate who the winner will be.
Seriously, forget Trump. He was never going to win and all this has done is dig the hole even deeper.
The real story is in the down ballot races now and how all this chaos will affect turnout. Make no mistake that Trump’s utter lack of a ground game and GOTV operations was going to hurt him already, but this is an unknown quantity. As more and more senators and congressmen/congresswomen abandon him in droves, Trump’s supporters will seethe rage and either not turn out to vote at all or just not vote for any down ballot Republicans.
This is exactly what Paul Ryan wanted to avoid above all else, but there’s nothing he can do. The die has been cast and there’s no going back.
Glad you posted this, Chris. I was especially saddened about the Central Park 5 doubling down by Trump. These young men served their full sentences for a crime they didn’t commit but will forever be scarred by. I heard one of this group speak last night and it was amazing to me that he was calm and thoughtful without any vestige of anger, although he must feel it. Contrast that with Trump’s remarks, same day, that these boys were guilty, despite DNA clearance and the guilty party being caught and jailed.
Your observations about Clinton’s intelligence and experience are important. She will be a steady, if predictable, hand on American governance. As for her tax policies – visit her webpage, Chris (-; the tax analysis I have seen score her plan more favorably than Trump’s, with the caveat that the “pay for” provision will largely be through increased taxes for the uber wealthy…I am more interested in the type of programs she wants to use tax dollars for, which I find more important to our country’s advancement.
It is the nature of our system of checks and balance that a President is limited in his/her power. That has never been so important as this election has proven. Frankly, although I will vote for Clinton, I am more deeply concerned about her ability to maintain stability if Dems don’t take the Senate. A period of stabilization is desperately needed in America. We must find our equilibrium between fiscal and social responsibility. It is my hope that out of this mess we have witnessed in the 2016 election, the opportunity to dialogue will become apparent and Republicans will be willing to start governing through consensus. Thus far, I haven’t seen much sense of desire on the part of the GOP to begin anew, but for our democratic process to work for all our people, not just those at the top, it must begin.
Before I sign off on this let me also state that Mike Pence is not the correct person to make this process happen on the right. His views and policy positions are too narrow. America is a big country with wonderful diversity. We should celebrate our differences while building a nation that has a common purpose for all our people. Freedom, equality, opportunity.
He seems to be on drugs. He may be connected to a crime family. He’s a rapist. And to some Republicans, I suppose, he’s good people.
In all seriousness, Chris, I logged in this morning just to add a comment on the last post asking, “Why is ‘grab her by the pussy’ worse than starting your campaign with ‘Mexicans are rapists’?” and am glad to see you’ve already answered just that question.
“Mike Pence was reportedly “beside himself.” Paul Ryan disinvited the nominee from his big shindig in Wisconsin today. Rep. Chaffetz and other prominent Republicans publicly withdrew their support. Though a bit more profane than usual, the video is entirely consistent with everything we’ve known about Donald Trump all along. Why are Republicans suddenly outraged by this?”
This is what you get when you combine extremely short term thinking with a hold on to power at any cost attitude. Look at the pro-life faction you mentioned as an example. They’ve convinced themselves that the next SCOTUS pick is Armageddon. If Scalia isn’t replaced by a hard right jurist, then nothing can be done. They think that draconian laws based on bogus medical claims are going to solve the abortion issue once and for all. Their blindness would be laughable if it wasn’t so dangerous. They are willing to overlook so much that is bad about Trump to get Roe vs Wade overturned, but even getting that won’t accomplish what they want. Some states would still allow abortion, and in the ones that didn’t you would get end-arounds like black market trafficking in RU-482. It’s a bad deal. Not worth all the downsides a Trump Presidency would bring.
As for the mysogyny, it’s definitely there. Not all pro-lifers have it, but the one who don’t really aren’t distancing themselves much from the troglodyte faction. I have my litmus test for which pro-lifers I can respect and which I can dismiss- are you willing to support easier access to birth control, sex-ed, and a safety net for poor single mothers? Are you willing to call out the RWNJs who demonize single mothers? If you answer “yes” to both questions, then we have some common ground, and we can work together to make abortion a rare thing.